Blu-Ray FTW

[Premonition]

yeah gh3 is a ton of fun!
Im the same way though. I rent dvd`s on Tuesdays (rent one get 1 free). I dont see paying 30 dollars to watch a movie that ill watch 1 time and never again.
Im perfectly happy with dvd quality. Not to mention i dont have a 1080 p tv (just 1080i) so i cant full advantage anyways and im sure not buying a new tv just to watch movies.

with the hole dtv stuff, i doubt many people wanna rush to buy a new tv right now when they know the tech is changing. The new tv`s that are coming out are like 6x better than 1080p tv`s.

[Sirex]

I reckon ms and paramount have some put some sort of money or funding into HD-DVD which is why they are hanging on to it.

As for what side... DVD does me fine, i dont care if i can see every hair on someones head, or the eye lashes perfectly.
I dont watch movies to awe at the images, i awe the story and how its told.

yeah yeah bigger data storage i get that but until cost = worth it, i'll stick with my HDD's and DVD-RW's for data and movies, well like i said i dont see the point in hd as i said i dont marvel at the images, if its a good story and told well and presented well it does not need to be "look you can see each of my hairs!"

[juneau]

ok n00b question.

speaking about microsoft and hd dvd and whatever. technically is there an hddvd player or blu ray player and you can put in your computer case just like a dvd drive or anything? if so, on a flatscreen is there hd quality?

thanks,

pesky n00b

Yes there is. But as with the standalones Blu-Ray comes packed with DRM and region locked. You also need to use a HDMI equipped video card, and possibley a HDMI monitor.

HDDVD doesn't have any of these problems.

I really can't understand why people want BR to win.

@Prem : Very good points and it goes to show that BR standalones are to expensive. Of all the people i know who have HD standalone players, which is 9 in total, all have HD-DVD players.

I'm nopt suprised that a lot of the studios are backing BR. Region locked and DRM are there babies. I for one am sick of it.

I also only know one person with a PS3. All the others have Xbox360's.

Being from Euorpe, i can see your points. however, i prefer BR to HDdvd.

The reason? Capacity. In the public sector, we've kind of hit a tough wall. much as we did prior to CD's and DVD's becoming available. the size of the drives we have are getting bigger. not everyone wants to rely on multiple drives, or can pony up for tape backup systems.

personally, i prefer to keep stuff on DVD's. lasts longer. alot of my CD's have outlived the multiple drive's i've ever backed stuff up onto.

And HD-DVD has gotten us what so far? a theoretical max of 51GB? a real tested out ther eversion of 15 & 30 for single and dual layer. BR has 25 & 50. theoreticals of 200gb have been shown and proven to work.

i could give a crap about the movies. i've seen both of the presentations 100x. actually? i hate the way the new videos lok on them. nothing looks MORE fake than huge tentacles attacking a ship in HD, or batman driving around in HD.

i liek the idea of being able to carry 50GB in my pocket, being able to pack up 50gb of stuff and taking it with me to a firends house, storing 50gb in ANYTHING. Capacity wins. until HD-DVD can obtain the same data cramming potential, BR has my vote.

As far as M$? article out of context? psh. its called covering their butts. i read it the same way gizmodo stated. the title made it more like they WERE than were not. but its similair to a few other large companies. they are covering their butts. they have clauses that say they can go one way or the other. the battle is far from won. M$ KNOWS it would be the final nail in the coffin for the PS3 if they listed an addon BR drive. what reason would there be to WRITE for the PS3? there is something FAR sinister behind the scenes here as to why they tossed that tidbit out there so quickly to "retract"(used VERY lightly) and contradict the statement that Reuters made it out to be. i am not stupid, i read it the way it was meant. they tried to take it out of context, but the thing is, it is possible. will M$? only time will tell.

until then, i'll stick with BR, Hate the PS3, ignore the 360, and watch movies on my dvd's happily until the format war is done.

Strangely i haven't once thought about the new formats in +R terms. Mainly because i think DVD will still be the main source of storage. DL disks never took off, and i can see the new formats being exactly the same.

How do the movies look fake? I've watched Batman Begins, and The Matrix trilogy in HD and it looked absolutely amazing. Similar to how DVD looked over VHS minus the analogue to digital aspect.

[Premonition]

I see storage like hard drives. They will only get bigger and bigger. Even hd-dvd and blu-ray are both looking at triple layers and stuff that increase that size. In a year we will probably see 100 gig disks or atleast be talking about them.

Oddly i think a wild card for the hd-war is the dual drives. they are just coming out and companies will make money on them. Like any war it pays to keep the war going.

Toshiba is rumored to be leasing the xbox 360 tech and if they do you will probably see a xbox 360 with hd-dvd built in. Toshiba also can appeal to companies like wal-mart. If they get the leading retailer behind them that will increase sales no matter how many movies they have. But i don't see Toshiba going down without a fight. Microsoft is more interested in downloading service and commented on how they think that will be the way of the future.

For right now though i dont see any reason to give up on dvd, the market is just to unstable and dvd is the only safe bet at this point. Not to mention for storage dvd and dual layer dvd`s are cheap as dirt.

[juneau]

I see storage like hard drives. They will only get bigger and bigger. Even hd-dvd and blu-ray are both looking at triple layers and stuff that increase that size. In a year we will probably see 100 gig disks or atleast be talking about them.

Oddly i think a wild card for the hd-war is the dual drives. they are just coming out and companies will make money on them. Like any war it pays to keep the war going.

Toshiba is rumored to be leasing the xbox 360 tech and if they do you will probably see a xbox 360 with hd-dvd built in. Toshiba also can appeal to companies like wal-mart. If they get the leading retailer behind them that will increase sales no matter how many movies they have. But i don't see Toshiba going down without a fight. Microsoft is more interested in downloading service and commented on how they think that will be the way of the future.

For right now though i dont see any reason to give up on dvd, the market is just to unstable and dvd is the only safe bet at this point. Not to mention for storage dvd and dual layer dvd`s are cheap as dirt.

I guess the DVD DL rip off is a UK thing then.

[Premonition]

you can get verbatum dvd dl disk for like $28-$35.00 normally here. Thats for a 20 pack. So your looking at less than 2 dollars a disk. Still a little pricey but they are a named brand and not generic. Ive never had a bad burn with verbatum disks.

Now you wanna see pricey look at blu-ray dvd+r... now they are expensive. But when you consider most pc`s have dvd-dl burners already the price of the dl disk are not bad. I mean its cheaper to buy generic dvd`s but you risk bad burns.

[pigworthy]

Interesting, I just read this post..... Most HD players of either type have been above $200 and now I just got advertisements of HD-DVD format player for $129. Get rid of obsolete equipment maybe? Let the begin!

[Premonition]

Actually the base model hd-dvd player is about that much. During the holidays it was 99 dollars. The next model is roughly 200-300. Best buy ran out of the cheap model during the holidays and messed up and gave away the upgraded that was 300 at the time (the sold out rather fast ).

But amazon has been advertising the hd-dvd addon for the 360 from 99-129 for the last few months. Its expected both formats will take another price cute soon. Even standalone blu-ray player is expected to come out with a 300 price tag soon.

They are in a price war at the moment and with sony getting wb its expected hd-dvd will take a price cut very soon to move more units and balance the war.

but if your in the market for a hd-dvd player, id hold off for a few motnhs and see where all this stuff goes. You can bet it will be cheaper thats for sure.

[pigworthy]

Ahhh...... Thanks Premonition.

[juneau]

you can get verbatum dvd dl disk for like $28-$35.00 normally here. Thats for a 20 pack. So your looking at less than 2 dollars a disk. Still a little pricey but they are a named brand and not generic. Ive never had a bad burn with verbatum disks.

Now you wanna see pricey look at blu-ray dvd+r... now they are expensive. But when you consider most pc`s have dvd-dl burners already the price of the dl disk are not bad. I mean its cheaper to buy generic dvd`s but you risk bad burns.

I always buy Taiyo Yuden DVD+R's. ?20 for 100. They are also considered to be the best blank DVD media on the market today.

Verbatim DVD+R DL 2.4x 8.5GB (25 Spindle)
?32.99
?38.76 inc VAT

That's close to $80.

[RobotBanana]

Now you wanna see pricey look at blu-ray dvd+r... now they are expensive. But when you consider most pc`s have dvd-dl burners already the price of the dl disk are not bad. I mean its cheaper to buy generic dvd`s but you risk bad burns.

Want to see pricey? Look at the costs of DVDs & DVD Burners when DVD was as new as Blu-Ray. I don't know if it was as high, but you most certainly couldn't pick up a dual-layer burner with Lightscribe for $40.

Point is, as with all technology, the costs of Blu-Ray will drop as time goes on. We're still in a "war" right now, but once there's a clear winner, Blu-Ray will start becoming standard. Microsoft's next console will inevitably have a Blu-Ray drive in it, and Blu-Ray drives/burners will become more common on PCs.

Regardless of who wins the format war, I'm covered. I have an HD-DVD drive in my HDMI-equipped laptop, and my PS3 is my Blu-Ray player. Although I've always kind of been rooting for Blu-Ray. I typically like Sony products, and it has a higher capacity than HD-DVD.

Just a few other things that the article didn't mention:

After Warner defected, HD-DVD cancelled their CES conference:
http://www.engadget.com/2008/01/04/h...f-warner-anno/

Universal's HD-DVD exclusivity contract has ended, and hasn't been renewed so far:
http://www.engadget.com/2008/01/10/u...sits-non-rene/

Interesting comparison of Blu-Ray and HD-DVD CES booths. HD-DVD looks deserted...
http://www.engadget.com/2008/01/10/b...08-booth-tour/
http://www.engadget.com/2008/01/10/hd-dvd-booth-tour/

Some people suspect that Apple will announce Blu-Ray equipped MacBooks at MacWorld. Apple sits on the board of directors for the Blu-Ray Disc Association, but hasn't exactly done anything to show it. Could that change?
http://www.macrumors.com/2008/01/03/...mac-pros-soon/

Slightly unrelated, but the PS3's sales numbers have increased quite a bit in the last few months. The introduction of the 40gig model and price cuts helped...
http://www.engadget.com/2007/11/15/s...nce-price-cut/

Also, Sony has managed to cut PS3 production costs by half since launch:
http://www.engadget.com/2008/01/12/s...-cost-in-half/

Things are definitely looking up for Sony and Blu-Ray...

[Premonition]

not really.... sony has lost 3.5 BILLION dollars in the gaming devision thanks to ps3.

Nikko Citigroup's Kota Ezawa estimates the games division will lose $1.4 billion this fiscal year, following last year's $2.1 billion loss. And while he doesn't expect the business to be prosperous until late 2009,

Then there is digital downloads. Now thats what Microsoft truly backs!

At the other end of the spectrum, I fear early adopters won?t care either as they are already, or will soon be, on the next big thing: digital downloads.

Indeed, my fourth bold prediction is that Blu-ray?s victory will be a hollow one. It is assumed that the winner will inherit a multibillion-dollar industry but Sony may actually struggle to recoup its development costs if the ultimate dream of couch potatoes comes true and high-definition movies are delivered directly into the living room.

The outcome of the format war could be another illustration of the ?last gasp? phenomenon outlined by Daniel Snow in this month?s Harvard Business Review. Professor Snow observes that when superior technologies emerge, old ones don?t just fade away: ?Their performance often leaps suddenly, thereby extending their lives and slowing the adoption of new technologies.?

It happened with sailing ships when steam-powered vessels were developed, with steel versus aluminium bicycle frames. The optical discs versus digital downloads battle could be another example. Sony should heed the warning that there is a danger in ?mistaking the last gasp as sustainable improvement. This can lead companies to overestimate the prospects of their products, overinvest in trying to enhance them, and wait too long to switch to the new technology.?

In other words, Sony faces a paradox: the impending success of Blu-ray could be bad news for the company because it will distract it from the real task of developing digital download systems. Blu-ray might well turn out to be the worst thing that ever happened to the Japanese electronics company. Mark my words.

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/to...cle3174760.ece

But sony is not in good shape. Only 3.5 million blu-ray players sold in america (3 million of those where ps3`s).
So if you look at the numbers
had-dvd and blu-ray combined make up only about 10% of the market.
Only 500k stand alone players have sold in america (thats real bad), now factor in that the ps3 is costing sony billions. Its not over yet for them.

Here is some key notes from microsoft at ces:

So here are the key facts and figures taken from Microsoft's CES talk earlier on - 1) 17.7 million Xbox 360's have been sold thus far 2) Xbox 360 generated 3.5 billion during November which is more than Nintendo and Playstation, 3) There are over 10 million Xbox Live members, 4) ABC and Disney will offer shows via the Video Marketplace and MGM are adding their video library to the Marketplace.

Now factor the wii outsold the ps3 by like 3:1 ratio and the xbox 360 still outsells the ps3. Sony is in rough shape in the console wars. Even if they win the hd format war they have alot to over come. Blu-ray can win and still not defeat dvd.

For right now there is just so much stuff up in the air. Its hard to say what will happen next, except prices have to come down as sales are still sucky. $199.00 is considered the sweet price for game consoles and they havent got there yet. TV`s are about to bypass the 1080p tech. Wii still is selling out.

[RobotBanana]

not really.... sony has lost 3.5 BILLION dollars in the gaming devision thanks to ps3.

Sony is in rough shape in the console wars.

Can't disagree there, but things are starting to look up for them. With production costs down and sales on the rise, they're on the right track.

As far as digital downloads go, only time will tell. IMO, discs will be around for a little longer. I think we'll need to see an increase in internet speeds before it really takes off. Of course, if this happens before people make the transition from DVD to Blu-Ray, Sony might have a problem...

[Rand{CLR}]

By the by, Amazon has dropped prices on many (all?) of their HD-DVD players by half. Clearance, anyone?

-Rand

[Premonition]

They raised the price back up of the hd-dvd addon for the xbox 360. Its back to $179.00
Oh well, i wouldn't have bought it anyways but if they start closing them out for like 50 dollars ill be all over 1 . I rent dvd`s anyways but for those extra special movies like transformers. It would be cool to have in hd.